On Monday evening, Donald Trump spoke to BBC News in an exclusive telephone interview, answering questions about Vladimir Putin, NATO and his reflections on the 2024 assassination attempt on him in Butler, Pennsylvania.
The BBC's chief North America correspondent, Gary O'Donoghue, says Trump was in a reflective state, even appearing vulnerable when discussing the assassination.
O'Donoghue explains how the interview came about and what it was like to speak exclusively with the US president.
Donald Trump has a habit of calling reporters without warning. The US president seems to prefer an impromptu phone conversation to a sit-down interview in front of the cameras.
On Monday night, it was my turn. And to tell you the truth, I was asleep when the White House called me.
I had spent most of five days believing there was a slim chance I would be able to conduct an interview with him, to mark the one-year anniversary of his assassination in Butler, Pennsylvania.
My reporting on that event had made headlines around the world and had probably caught the president's attention. So I figured that maybe that connection could be the key to securing a presidential interview, something that's quite rare for foreign news outlets in the US.
On Sunday evening I was told I was just minutes away from the call, so my team and I were ready to record, but it didn't come.
By Monday evening, I had given up on the idea that the interview would happen. After several grueling weeks in the field nonstop, I was sleeping. And that's when the phone rang.
I answered half asleep, and heard the voice of Press Secretary, Caroline Leavitt:
"Hi Gary, I'm here with the president, I'm getting through."
I rushed into the living room, frantically searching for the digital recorder; the line went dead and I thought I had lost it. But they came back and we spent almost 20 minutes talking about everything – from that terrible night at Butler, to his frustrations with Vladimir Putin, his changing stance on NATO and his thoughts on the UK.
Here are the five main points from that unexpected conversation:
- Trump shows a different side
He was reflective at times and showed sensitivity when he spoke about the attempted murder – it is obvious that he does not feel comfortable discussing that event.
For a president who is often known for his spontaneous way of speaking and who is adored for it by his supporters, there were some long pauses and reflections that you rarely see from him.
When I asked him if that event had changed him, he expressed himself with rare sensitivity:
“I don’t like to dwell on that event, because if I do, it would be, you know, life-changing… and I don’t want that to be the case.”
He then added that he believes in "the power of positive thinking, or the power of not thinking positively."
When I asked him if he trusted Russian President Vladimir Putin, there was a very long pause. Finally, he said:
"I trust almost no one, to be honest."
- No commitment to concrete figures on deportations
I moved on to American domestic politics and asked him if his plan for mass deportations is working – both in terms of speed and the fact that it sometimes involves people he probably wouldn't want deported.
The president insisted that his team is doing a "great job" in delivering on campaign promises, citing a drastic reduction in the number of migrants crossing from Mexico.
Some members of his staff have expressed frustration with the slow pace of deportations. When I pressed him for a figure that would count as a success during this second term, Trump declined to provide numbers.
“I don’t put a number on it, but I want criminals to get out quickly, and we are doing that, as far as I know,” he said. “We are taking them to El Salvador, and many other places.”
- More frustration with Putin
Trump openly expressed his frustration with Russian President Vladimir Putin, capping a day in which he had threatened a second round of economic sanctions on Moscow if a deal on Ukraine was not reached within 50 days.
Having promised during the campaign to end the war quickly, Trump seemed surprised that he had not yet reached a deal with Putin.
“I thought we had made a deal four times and then you come home, and they just attacked a nursing home or something in Kiev. I said, ‘What the hell was that?’”
Ukrainian President Zelensky and other European leaders have long accused Putin of not being serious about ending the war – so these feelings of doubt are not new to them.
When I asked Trump if he had closed the chapter with the Russian leader, he still left one door open:
"I'm not done with him, but I'm disappointed in him."
- New tone towards NATO
When I mentioned that he had once called NATO "obsolete," he told me that he now thinks the opposite – that the alliance is in a new phase and is getting stronger.
He recently hosted NATO Secretary General Mark Rutte – with whom he appears to have a good relationship – at the White House. They announced a deal to sell US weapons to NATO, which will then be sent to Ukraine.
Trump gave signs that he was abandoning his early dissatisfaction with the financial burden the US bore on other allies.
“It was very unfair because the United States was paying almost 100% of the costs, but now they are paying the bills themselves and I think that is much better,” he said – referring to the recent pledge by member states to increase defense spending to 5% of GDP.
"We have changed NATO a lot," he concluded.
- Respect for Starmer and the United Kingdom
Trump stressed his respect for the United Kingdom and its new Prime Minister, Sir Keir Starmer – with whom he had recently signed an agreement to remove some trade barriers.
“I really like the prime minister, even though he is a liberal,” he said.
He praised the relationship between the US and Britain as being as "special" as many Britons think, and added that he believes Britain would stand by the US if a war broke out.
He did not seem concerned about the lack of an official invitation to address Parliament during his state visit later this year:
“Let's let them enjoy the holidays,” he said with a laugh.
He spoke kindly of his future host, King Charles:
“He is a great gentleman.”
And he took a sporting approach to a recent speech the King gave to the Canadian Parliament, which some interpreted as an implicit criticism of Trump.
He dismissed it with a smile.
